« The One Day Muni Negotiations | Main | Zig Zag Bail Bonds Park »

May 19, 2009

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00d83514497653ef011570969585970b

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference Prop 8 Ruling Will Come Out Soon! It's Prediction Time! :

Comments

When you do these kinds of "look back at the facts and use your legal knowledge" know how to decode stuff like this for the rest of us who don't have a law degree....well....all I can say is PLEASE continue and if I ever go to law school please allow me to take one of your classes...

Good summary. One thing I haven't seen the press or commentators explain -- what's the reason the challenge to prop 8 was brought under the State Constitution's Equal Protection Clause and not under both the Federal Equal Protection Clause and the State Equal Protection Clause? I'm speculating here, but were the challengers trying to avoid potential federal court review?

Patrick - You are correct that supporters of gay marriage want to avoid the Federal Equal Protection clause. This is so, at least in part, because the US Supreme Court has never recognized homosexuals as a "suspect class" - which is the designation that gets any law singling out that class scrutinized carefully. In CA, the Cal State Supreme Court ruled in IRMC that gay people are a suspect class - which is why the law singling out gay people for different treatment was held to be unconstitutional.

To put it another way: criminals are not a suspect class. You can make up all kinds of laws that treat them differently and not violate the equal protection clause. That's why getting that "suspect class" designation is important.

The USSC hasn't exactly held that gay people are NOT a suspect class, but given the current makeup of the Court, no one wants to test their luck.

Thank you for writing!!

Melissa, I hope you're right ... but watching the oral arguments in March was the three longest hours of my life. Joyce Kennard wasn't just hard on gay marriage proponents ... she was EXTREMELY defensive. And while she may have been a little that way last year, folks I've talked to said the opposite ... it was almost like having one of our lawyers on the bench. She's a strange one ... never shy to express her opinions, always leaves her cards on the table, but doesn't have a lot of influence with her colleagues.

Ron George, I'd say, was also pretty bad ... although I believe that if he does rule in our favor (as you said), it would be because Ken Starr's logic was so insane. But George is a cautious guy, and I can see him issue a ruling upholding Prop 8 ... while explicitly repudiating Starr's reasoning and implications.

@Paul - as usual, you are correct. This will be a very close case that could easily go in favor of Prop 8.

What court precedents exist that would lend credence to the hypothesis that Prop 8 is an amendment?

@Michael - There are no direct precedents that say Prop 8 is an amendment OR that say it is not an amendment. This is a case of first impression for the Court. Thank you for writing!

Great analysis of the arguments, Melissa!

The Court just announced that no decisions will be published tomorrow. I think what fueled a lot of speculation about a decision tomorrow was SFPD delivering barricades in the Castro last night. But that's for tomorrow's 30th anniversary of the White Night Riots. (Which, by the way, would have made for an exceedingly poor choice of date for the Court to publish its decision.)

That leaves next Tuesday and Thursday and the following Monday (6/1) as the only possible remaining "Decision Days." My prediction is a decision on 5/28 overturning Prop 8. I'll be happy to be wrong on the first, but not the second, part of my prediction.

Just for further clarification of the point Melissa was making for Patrick...

On the Equal Protection Clause, the United States Supreme Court sets the floor for suspect classes, in other words no State law can violate the rights of these recognized suspect classes. It does not, however, limit a state from recognizing its own set of additional suspect classes (or in common terms, it does not "set the ceiling").

In the case of California, Iowa, Hawaii and numerous other states, sexual orientation is a protected class and the Federal Government, absent a law from Congress, has no authority to hear a case on the subject. That is why there is no discussion on a Federal challenge.

Great summary - and while IANAL, I think the court has only really two options, throw out Prop 8 or get the state out of the marriage business. Of those two options, throw out Prop 8 seems the more likely since it is the less disruptive remedy of the two. And I'll go way way out on a limb here and say that the ruling will be unanimous; here is my reasoning (and it follows the Jerry Brown argument) marriage is a right that comes from Article 1, Section 1. This case isn't about marriage equality now - it is about whether the electorate can cherry pick rights away from minority groups. To me, the answer has to be a resounding NO. To rule otherwise would be to toss out one of the basic principles to which the republic (both California and for that matter the United States) were founded - equality under the law. The key difference as to why I think it will be unanimous is that prior to IRMC gay people were not a suspect class - AFTER IRMC gay people are a suspect class. That designation is a very key point - and I think the majority in IRMC put it there to guard against something exactly like Prop 8 from happening. The dissenting justices in IRMC can't just ignore it - it is settled law in California. It was funny how Justice Kennard kept telling everybody that we have a different constitution after Prop 8 - which was true. What I think she was hinting at was that we had a different constitution also after IRMC - and I believe the changes that were codified after IRMC trump the change that was made by Prop 8 - the suspect classification is the key.

Fantastic! This is the best summary I've read since Prop 8 was enacted. I'm a fan of your blog!

Pleasure meeting you at Etiquette the other night.

Alright Griff, I've caught up on all your materials, and I'm sad to say that I'm going to have to disagree with your prediction. I see Hawaii all over again....

Same sex couples want to get married. CHECK
People sue. CHECK
Court says nothing we can do about it, they're protected. CHECK
Court continues...absent the legislature or the voters telling us differently IN THE CONSTITUTION, we have to uphold the suspect class' right to enjoy something other classes enjoy. CHECK

CA is a little different in that it attempted the IRMC first, court said "Hey douchebags, we said in the constitution, this just a regulation..." REJECTION.

Then, the voters make a constitutional change to ban same sex marriage. CHECK

In Hawaii that decision was upheld and I suspect the same will happen next week.

The only way I see this being overturned is if the court decides procedurally that there's an imbalance in requiring 2/3 majority of the legislature to amend the constitution but a simple majority of the electorate to amend the constitution, but a decision like that will unravel 50+ voter approved amendments to the constitution (I'm not saying I wouldn't want to see that, but simply that it's unlikely). The Bay Area Council would love it though because it would force a constiutional convention...

So I hope I'm wrong, but I think Prop 8 stands and in the next decade the voters overturn it as familiarity breeds more tolerance. Younger voters support gay marriage 2-1 over the elderly. Embarrasingly, it's just going to take more time in CA.

The comments to this entry are closed.

My Photo
only search Melissa's site

Enter your email address:

Delivered by FeedBurner